MATISSE ROGERS

MUSIC: Complexion (A Zulu Love)- Kendrick Lamar

 

My name is Matisse Rogers and I am your host for “Watch Your Tone,” a podcast delving into the manifestations and effects of colorism and skin tone biases in our everyday lives. 

 

EXCERPT: “A Girl Like Me”

 

My name is Matisse Rogers. I’m from Minneapolis, Minnesota, and I’m currently a junior at the University of Michigan studying Public Policy with a Minor in Writing. I hope to go into the law in the future, focusing on civil rights and ways that I can affect social change or social responsibility within business measures. I’m biracial. My father is black. Both his mother and his father came from Anguilla, an island in the Caribbean. On the other hand, my mom is white, with parents who came from Ireland, as well as Great Britain. That was several generations back. My mom is from a small town on a farm in Minnesota, whereas my dad is from Perth Amboy, which is an urban and very ethnically diverse neighborhood in New Jersey. I chose to create this podcast on colorism because I’m aware that I’ve been a beneficiary of it and I’d like to learn more about it. I want to know what it comes from, the ways that it affects people’s lives that I can’t see just from looking at them or even listening to hip hop or watching movies. I want to know more about the topic so I can do more to undermine it as I move ahead with my academics.

 

This will be primarily focusing on colorism within the African American community, although it shows up among nearly every racial minority or majority across the world. We’ll be using dialogue, history, and hard conversations to learn more along the way.

 

What is colorism? Essentially, colorism is a facet of racism that relates to intra-racial discrimination, or within racial groups, typically against those with darker skin.

 

Oxford Dictionary defines colorism as “prejudice or discrimination against individuals with a dark skin tone, typically among people of the same ethnic or racial group.”  In Watch Your Tone, we are looking to provide personal and provocative examples to this definition, as well as shape a definition of our own. It shows up everywhere, often going unnoticed. It is in music,

 

MUSIC: Right Above It- Lil Wayne Ft. Drake

 

It’s in Hollywood and the media, it affects socioeconomic opportunity, even politics, extending to length of prison sentencing. How many of the black politicians you can think of are dark skinned? Even moving a step beyond that, what did the presidency of Barack Obama mean for a culture of colorism? Did this add to colorism within the black community and the larger American population, or did it begin to alleviate it?

 

EXCERPT: Barack Obama on Being Biracial on 'The View'

 

We’ll answer these questions and more through the “Watch Your Tone” series.  While later episodes will delve deeper into the different ways that colorism can present itself, today we are going to have an introduction to the topic and its consequences on day-to-day life. The ways that it can show up in ways that are often overlooked. The micro- version of colorism. Our goal today is definition. Let’s all get up to speed on the historical and present-day definitions of colorism. Let’s ask the hard questions about discrimination between minority groups who face racism as a unit every day. Let’s uncover the forms of discrimination in our society that aren’t often talked about.

 

Each episode, we will have a different guest who offers personal perspective to the topic of colorism. Today’s guest is a University of Michigan sophomore, Olabimpe Amokomowo, or Ola for short. I met Ola through my pre-law fraternity. We are one of the six members of our pre-law fraternity who is African-American or has African ancestry, out of 100+ members. Ola, thank you for joining us. Let’s get started

 

OLA: Hi, I’m Olabimpe Amokomowo but I go by Ola. I’m majoring in international studies and I’m 19 years old.

 

MATISSE: Where are you from?

 

OLA: I’m from Severn, Maryland which is a town right outside of Baltimore.

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MATISSE: How would you self-identify your race and your skin tone?

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OLA: I would say that I’m a dark-skinned African American woman. Specifically, Afro-Caribbean American woman because my parents are from Nigeria and Barbados.

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MATISSE: I didn’t know that- I have family from Barbados! My dad’s side. My grandma.

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OLA: Oh okay, that’s awesome.

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MATISSE: In your opinion, how would you define colorism? What does it mean to you?

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OLA: I think of colorism- defining it academically- as systemic discrimination against people that have more melanin or darker pigment to their skin in comparison to their lighter counterparts within their own race. With the idea that the palest skin is the most ideal and represents the best parts of society. But personally, I think it’s just like people’s preconceived notions about darker-skinned people like that people with dark skin are dirty or stupid or not as a successful or not as good as other people. Personally, I think of it like that and having curlier or kinky hair that’s not relaxed also plays a large part. I think that on campus, it’s a lot of jokes. Off-handed jokes, especially since we go to a predominately white institution (PWI), it’s going to come through a lot in causal speech. Whereas in the grand scheme of things, it’s access to jobs, when you go in for an interview that could be something you’re dinged for, it could come up in schooling again when you have to present or speak one-on-one with your professor. Especially since we’re liberal arts majors and when we’re writing an essay the grading is kind of subjective, I’ve heard it can kind of influence that. This is very niche but in dating and things like that, it really does come to play with men, even within our own race. Black men are very against dating someone that’s dark because they don’t want darker-skinned children, even if their mom is black as night. It’s this idea that to marry up or having a better relationship that improves your social class and social standing, you want to be seen with someone that’s lighter over someone that’s darker. And darker skinned women have to do a lot more to be considered beautiful. Lupita Nyong’o is completely phenomenal but she also has the perfect body, perfect teeth, the way she speaks is incredibly eloquent. Versus someone from the hood that may not look like that or may be larger or something like that are still seen as undesirable because they also have dark skin.

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MATISSE: It sounds like it makes it a lot harder for people to get ahead or even get to the point that their white or lighter-skinned counterparts are starting from. When did you become cognizant of colorism or aware that there can be discrimination within one racial group?

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OLA: I think when I was younger- I grew up in Barbados for a few years. I lived in Barbados from age 2 to 4 ½ or something like that.

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MATISSE: That’s so cool!

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OLA: The fact that my grandparents- I don’t know how to explain it. My grandparents are from a higher social class in Barbados, my grandma isn’t fully black and my mom is light- a lot lighter than my father is. My father is from Nigeria, he’s very dark skinned. Coming home and having my grandparents jokingly refer to me as the dark baby or the “darkie” or telling me “don’t go out in the sun, you’re dark enough”- things like that. When I was younger I thought it was a problem but then I went through a shift in my preteens where I got even darker. I spend 6 or 8 weeks in Barbados with my grandparents and I ended up very dark, so I became a lot more cognizant of it. Coming back to middle school, everyone was like “oh you look so different. You look so different.” And I didn’t see a problem with it, but I looked into lightening creams and things like that. That was just an idea that, maybe this is a problem that I’m this dark. From when I was very young I had a resurgence of those thoughts when I was 12 or 13.

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MATISSE: Did you go to public school for high school?

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OLA: I went to a public school for 3 years but I went to a charter school from 6th grade to 9th grade.

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MATISSE: What was the demographic makeup, roughly, of your high school?

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OLA: It was like 60% white, maybe 20% black and 20% miscellaneous or students that didn’t align with any race. So it was predominately white, and the black kids came from a variety of different towns, but the socioeconomic level was pretty much the same for the most part. I’d say it was predominately white and then since I was in a special program at the high school, that was predominately white. There may have been 6 or 7 black kids in a 75-person class.

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MATISSE: Was that based on who lived in the area the way a normal public school would be?

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OLA: My public school wasn’t normal- it was completely gerrymandered.

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MATISSE: Yeah, it sounds confusing.

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OLA: Since we drew from so many areas we had a lot of wealthier white students that came from the Pasadena/Annapolis area, and then we had poorer black students that came from the Glenberg area, and so that came together and there were lots of racial tensions. The white kids thought they were better and that the black kids were only there so we had good sports and things like that. That was really hard to deal with being in an advanced program, where that stereotype didn’t necessarily fit me. But then the black kids also didn’t really want to interact with me because of that divide. It’s kind of like that idea of too black for the white kids and too white for the black kids.

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MATISSE: I very much relate to that. Especially being biracial. I would definitely say I was raised culturally white, because I’m from Minnesota- there’s not many black people in Minnesota. All of my dad’s family is in New Jersey, so I grew up around my mom’s family. Most of my close friends were white because even though I was in the Minneapolis Public Schools system, I went to the top schools within that system, so it was the kids from the richest neighborhoods in Minneapolis, so I relate to that. It sounds like you had people from a lot of different backgrounds come to your school. How do you think growing up in a more impoverished area rather than a more affluent area might affect or not affect the way colorism shows up for people?

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OLA: I think that when you’re looking at it from the hood in comparison to a normal suburb- I grew up in a normal suburb but I had the benefit of growing up in a suburb where there were lots of black families because it was near the military base. So there were well-off black people that I got to surround myself with.

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MATISSE: Was it middle class?

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OLA: I would say middle to upper-middle class. It was kind of on the edge where it was upper-middle class. Everyone had nice cars, everyone went on vacations, things like that. The black students that were in the higher level classes and programs and were going off to college were from my neighborhood, versus the ones from the other towns were going into the military- a lot went to the military from my high school- or they went to community college or they weren’t going to college at all. I think that a lot of the more negative comments I got about my skin were from people in that well-off area because a lot of them were going to HBCU’s. They were in-tune with the culture so that colorism was culture and it was more of “you’re lucky you’re so smart. You’re going to end up well because no man is going to want to marry someone with dark skin.” Going through the transition of my hair from relaxed to natural to high school I was getting a lot of comments like “I don’t know why you just wont keep it straight,” or “I don’t know why you wear weave.” Hearing comments like that mostly came from people from that side. I think I had a lot more support in some aspects from the kids from more impoverished areas. They were like it’s so cool that you’re doing this and you’re black. I would say there was that divide- I wasn’t really good friends with them- but they weren’t as derogatory and negative in comparison to people from more well-off neighborhoods. I feel like colorism is a lot more prevalent when you’re going to an HBCU or college or trying to move up in society, there is that idea that there are parts of me that I need to change for respectability politics. You see all wealthy dark-skinned men with lighter women and you see a lot of women that are successful do have lighter skin in politics and business. Those professions where you are the face for black people doesn’t represent the entire spectrum of skin tones, it’s like the top half.

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MATISSE: I feel like a lot of that stems from equating being closer to whiteness with being closer to success. Maybe it’s like the people who are going to college and are driven in advancing a professional career are like this is what I’m going to do to get ahead.

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OLA: I think that in our community there’s a lot more emphasis on respectability and the social side of getting a job, whereas if you’re white you’re just thinking I need to get a nice suit, need to make sure my resume is good, and need to go into the interview. Whereas I’m like I need to get my hair done, can’t be too ghetto, can’t be too nappy, needs to be natural but needs to look good. I need to make sure I have a great suit; I need to make sure my resume is impeccable- there can be no mistakes. I need to make sure that I’m code switching. I need to make sure my language is as eloquent as possible. I need to make sure they know I’m ready for this and they can see past the fact that I’m black. You don’t really have to think about that in other races as much- even mainly just being white. You don’t have to think about the things you have to do to present yourself professionally. Blackness isn’t equated with professionalism.

I used to do ballet for 10 years- I went to ballet school and I was one of three black students in the program. The other two were a lot lighter than me- one was biracial.

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MATISSE: How big was the program?

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OLA: Overall throughout all the grade it was 150-175 girls and in my specific class there were probably 20. Out of that 20 there were 3 black students, one Asian student and one Latina student. That’s pretty good representation. But in pictures and going into tech week we had to wear lipstick. One time we did really well on our exams- it was the Royal Academy of Dance program- so our teacher hired a professional makeup artist to do our makeup for the show. Now…thank the lord my mom sold Markey on the side and had her entire kit with her because lord knows I would have looked ridiculous if she hadn’t been there. Literally I was in the bathroom crying and washing it off and having her redo it for me.

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MATISSE: Oh no.

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OLA: Because I looked terrible- I looked ashy, I looked bad. She obviously had no idea what she was doing for my skin. And rather than say that, I just looked a mess. It was more so embarrassing that not only do I not look like these girls; I’m never going to be treated like these girls or feel as confident as they are. My mom was very helpful but she didn’t do that great of a job either because she is several shades lighter than me, lord knows. But it was a lot better and she was very comforting that entire time. That’s always something that sticks out to me because this year has been the year that I decided to not wear makeup at all. I was very cognizant of my skin tone before when shopping for makeup- like you can’t go to the drugstore. You have to to MAC or Sephora- the higher end brands- to find shades that fit. So just being someone that used to be really into makeup, used to wear it every day and used to love makeup, choosing not to wear it to not support the industry and make sure that its known that you don’t have to wear makeup to be beautiful is really helpful. I think about that a lot when I think about consumerism- not many things are marketed toward darker skinned women. You wouldn’t see someone with my skin tone in a J Crew ad- even though recently I’ve seen darker skinned models.

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MATISSE: I think so too.

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OLA: Victoria’s Secret had a lot more than normal. It was amazing watching the fashion show this year and seeing people with darker skin. There’s been a shift in marketing towards people with darker skin but its also geared to pandering because when they do release their darker shades, they’re like “yeah sis, now there’s one for you!” and I’m like, “don’t call me sis. Just make 45 foundation shades. You don’t have to market- I was going to buy it anyway. Relax.”

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MATISSE: What I feel like is kind of problematic about the makeup industry is that- yes, it’s great that now there’s greater representation and now there’s darker foundation shades, but I feel like they’re doing it because it’s part of a trend right now rather than because they think they need to represent these women. I’m sure you saw the Fenty beauty. People were shook when they saw that many foundation shades. Why was this not already a thing?

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OLA: You see Kylie Jenner making a big deal about it on her twitter.

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MATISSE: Did you see her new concealers?

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OLA: Yeah, and she’s trying to make it a big deal. If Fenty hadn’t have dropped, I know this literally would have had 5 shades. It’s this idea that- people just don’t think darker skinned women are going to pay for that because they don’t think they have the wealth to do that and that’s so annoying. I would like to spend it on this and support this brand that’s amazing, but now I don’t want to support it at all. I don’t want to buy your lipsticks; I don’t want to buy your mascara because you haven’t marketed this to me because you don’t think that there’s enough people that have that money when there are. It’s again this idea that darker skinned people aren’t as successful. And that’s why I love brands like MAC even though I hate having to compromise my morals about animal cruelty but I also want to be able to use foundations and things like that. Then you have the other side of the spectrum, where cruelty-free brands are more liberal and edgy and don’t market to darker skinned women either. So you’re stuck between a rock and a hard place. You can’t be ethical and have a product because the brands don’t think about that. It’s almost like animal rights are more important that POC rights which is really annoying. When you think of darker foundation people always think of black people. Indian people have really dark skin too. Latina people that don’t identify as African American also have really dark skin. It’s like that Andre 3000 art installation that he did, where he had the jumpsuit that said “Across all cultures, darker people suffer most. Why?”. Colorism isn’t only within the African American community, its within all communities. There’s a hierarchy where people with darker skin are thought to be worse.

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MATISSE: How do you think colorism interacts or doesn’t interact with racism?

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OLA: I think that it depends on where you are. In the US, no matter how light your skin is down South, you’re still black. Whereas, in more mixed and liberal areas, colorism becomes more prevalent because you have discrimination within populations. Down South I feel like there’s more of a united front that they’re going to hate us regardless so we might as well stand together. Up north, you see a lot more of that distinction. Even in recent years it has been getting better due to callout culture and people in the community with darker skin being like “hey, we have issues too” or when we see casting decisions. As much as everyone loves Yara Shahidi, keeping her accountable- why is everyone on your new show light skinned or white? Why don’t you have any dark skinned actresses on the show? That was a really great thing that blackish had- they had so many different skin tones. I feel like there’s been a lot more of holding people accountable and working together to fight racism. At the end of the day, lets not split our community and let’s focus on the fact that we have- not a common enemy- but should be looking towards fighting racism as a whole with each other.

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MATISSE: I agree with that. I remember maybe 5 or more years ago the internet was obsessed with #TeamLightskin versus #TeamDarkskin which is absolutely ridiculous. At least it’s nice to see that trends like that have faded away. Why is one race dividing itself into teams?

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OLA: Now the new debate is PWI versus HBCU. I feel like we have such a divisive community. With white people, you don’t really see that distinction between poor white and wealthy white. Within our community, we’re very much segregated between black people from the hood, black people who made it, educated black people, light skin, dark skin, PWI, HBCU, that’s the way we’re always pit against each other. It’s our own fault but also there are outside influences that we have to look at.

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MATISSE: Is the PWI versus HBCU debate on social media? I haven’t seen it.

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OLA: I’m laughing because it’s hilarious. It’s almost nightly on twitter.

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MATISSE: What is there to say?

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OLA: Like, don’t complain about “I hate white people” if you chose to go to a PWI and didn’t go to an HBCU. People who go to PWI’s are like shut up, your degree isn’t as valid. They’re not wrong in some aspects. Some are like don’t talk to me if you go to Arkansas A&M and I’m at Harvard about why you chose your HBCU. You chose your HBCU because you couldn’t get in. It’s like that mentality- diving themselves about who’s more successful. Another one was like how are you going to be at your PWI talking about “Black Lives Matter” when you don’t even support black owned institutions? Like what? What type of stretch?

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MATISSE: Even just looking at the selection, not everyone is going to an HBCU. I don’t even know how many there are.

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OLA: There’s surprisingly a lot. Arkansas A&M probably exists.

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MATISSE: I think of the most famous ones.

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OLA: Yeah like Howard, Hampton, Spelman, Morehouse. There’s so many A&M’s, even ones you wouldn’t think of. In Maryland we have U of M Eastern Shore, Coppan, Morgan State, Howard’s not really in Maryland but I’ll count it, UDC, there’s so many. But they’re so regional often times. Unless you’re in that community or you’re a white kid going on a football scholarship, you just don’t know about certain HBCUs.

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MATISSE: Did you apply to any?

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OLA: I was going to apply to Howard and Howard only because my uncle, aunt and mom are all Howard alum, but they didn’t have my major at the time. I wanted to do International Politics and they just didn’t have that. I didn’t want to pay to get a degree in government where I’m not going to get to do what I want to do just to go to an HBCU. It’s just not as organized as a PWI. It doesn’t hold that prestige in social communities. And then you have to think about colorism- I’d love an all black community, but you can also find that at a PWI.

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I now wanted to talk a little bit about the role of colorism on college campuses. There has been a lot going on at the University of Michigan: resistance against Richard Spencer’s request to speak, the rise and fall of the #BBUM (being black at University of Michigan movement), and racist sentiments that were written on a student’s dorm in West Quad earlier this year. Here’s a quick history lesson: The University of Michigan does not have an affirmative action policy within admissions, which is based on a statewide decision from 2006. The Michigan Civil Rights Initiative, or Proposal 2 (Prop 2 as I’ll refer to it), was drafted and voted on during the 2006 Michigan election. Prop 2 sought to “amend the state constitution to ban affirmative action programs that give preferential treatment to groups or individuals based on their race, gender, color, ethnicity or national origin for public employment, education or contracting purposes.” Sounds difficult. Sounds like it would have made admission harder for those who come from underprivileged neighborhoods. But surprisingly, 58% of people voted for Michigan Prop 2, while only 42% voted against it. It is true that there are conservatives living in Michigan, as we saw from the recent Presidential election, but Affirmative Action is something enacted at public schools nationwide. I know Texas also has restrictions on it, but other than that, Michigan is one of the only places where it isn’t allowed. This statewide ban on affirmative action has been really detrimental for the diversity at the University of Michigan, something that I really took to heart when making my college decision. In 2006, the University was made up of 10% black students, and now this is at 4.1% in 2015. It might even be lower now, the fall of 2017. It is possible that the ban of affirmative action at the University of Michigan has not only hurt the holistic evaluation of these minority applicants, but has discouraged them to apply to Michigan. If a school isn’t willing to enact policy that supports your admission… why even strive for admission at all?

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MATISSE: From your perspective, what has the campus climate felt like this year?

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OLA: It’s felt a lot more amplified. You were with me that one time when we chose not to go to the protest because we didn’t have a good gut feeling about it and someone ended up getting arrested. I think in situations like that I’m very cognizant of the campus climate. At the end of the day, a lot of the people I interact with haven’t talked to the black community. It feels like a lot of white people going crazy. In the black University of Michigan group chat, everyone’s like I’m good. We don’t want Richard Spencer to come but we’re fine. We’re focused on our academics. A lot of the protests that are happening have not been from the Black Student Union. It’s been from white student orgs that are protesting. I think that this has been a year of, in reaction to the campus climate, so many people are tired. And so its been a lot more focus on self care rather than divisive action. In recent years, we’ve realized the university doesn’t care about us. We released a statement from the Black Student Union to Schlissel and he denied it. And Hillel also made a statement and he had some divisive action. After consistently being ignored we’ve reflected inward and we don’t interact as much with other orgs on campus. We focus more on making sure our community is safe and feels well. That’s why we’ve had a lot of events geared towards black students and only black students. The campus is becoming more divided, but in a positive way. It’s not tension, its more so this has happened to us, we don’t like it and we’re not going to stand for it. So we’re not going to engage, which I find admirable in a way.

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MATISSE: It is. Do you think some people are looking at it as not caring rather than taking time for self care? How do you think its being interpreted?

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OLA: I think that people from CSG and things like that have been getting offended that the black orgs aren’t cooperating with the ways they think it should be done. People don’t realize how much energy it takes to consistently have to humanize and defend your right to be somewhere. It’s constantly being told that we don’t care, we don’t really belong, we’ll take your money but we wont listen. So I feel like standing with each other- even with allies. The constant need to tell allies you’re doing a great job, thanks for being here is exhausting too. You don’t want to congratulate someone for being a decent human. I think that a lot of the organizations on campus are getting frustrated or they don’t understand or feel like they have to do more because we’re doing nothing. They don’t have to. If these students feel safer staying home or having an event off campus, let them do that. They have the right to do that.

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MATISSE: Have you ever noticed colorism within your classes at Michigan?

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OLA: Not really. I’ve talked about colorism in my Spanish classes but I wouldn’t say there’s been a presence of colorism. Just a lot of discussion in classes without any- I don’t feel discriminated against because of my skin color.

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MATISSE: In general, at Michigan you don’t?

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OLA: Not in general at Michigan, like I said there’s a lot of causal microagressions like people making stupid jokes. But in classes and on an institutional level I don’t think I’ve ever felt that.

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 MATISSE: Do you feel it more in social settings?

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OLA: Yeah, I do. I would do a lot of stuff through the Opportunity Hub and they took pictures of me to show “black hair in the workplace” and I never felt discriminated against for my skin. I went to Chicago with them and I was featured on the Instagram and twitter and they had me present at a fair. I feel like it’s a reverse colorism where they want to show that they have black students here more than it being negative.

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MATISSE: And you don’t think that’s tokenization, you think it’s support?

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OLA: I think that in some ways it has to be done. Even if I were a white student, some of the things I’ve done are cool and people would want to hear about them so I feel like I could be invited regardless. But then also there’s certain things they’ll ask me to talk about where I’m like okay, you want a black perspective on it. There are other black students and international students, so I think they were looking for a diverse group of people. Staff in the LSA opportunity hub, there are 3 or 4 African American black women. I love them, they love me and its always great talking to them and hearing how they immediately code switch and how causal they get and comfortable they get. I think its also good for them to be able to uplift black students in the community and get to interact with them because they realize how predominately white Michigan is.

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Can you define code switching?

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OLA: Code switching to me is the way that you present yourself based on the community you’re within. Great examples of code switching are slang and the talk that you use. I’d be more comfortable slipping into causal Ebonics if I’m with a group of black people but when I’m around white people or in a professional setting I feel the need to talk more eloquent and use my hands more like I’m doing right now. I feel like I have to- again with the respectability politics, put on a show to prove that I’m worthy of being in the space.

I know that you are biracial, do you identify more as biracial or black?

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MATISSE: Growing up, I always identified more as biracial because my parents would tell my brother and I, you guys are mixed. You’re biracial. When you’re filling out surveys you’re going to check both boxes or check the “two or more” races box. There was a huge emphasis on being biracial and not just being black. But as I’ve gotten older, I’ve realized that no matter how light skinned you are, you’re going to be perceived as black. It goes back to things like the one drop rule. If you look anything but white, people will identify you as black. Now I’ve come a lot closer to identifying myself as black rather than biracial and I think a lot of that is just because of the public’s perception rather than how I was raised. That’s something that my brother is still dealing with now. He goes to the University of Minnesota and he got offered a spot in this wing of a dorm for black men to create a campus community because there’s not many there, and he turned it down because he was like, I don’t want to be living with just black people. I’m not just black. So he’s a few steps behind me in that sense. Also, you talked about this a little bit, I think he was scared of the cultural differences.

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OLA: Yeah, it can be hostile. Our community is- I love it and I hate it. We’re so built on, not tearing each other down, but the banter and discourse. I could easily see it become negative very fast for someone who doesn’t identify fully as black.

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MATISSE: I identify as both. People have asked me if I think I identify from white privilege and it’s like no, I’m not white. I benefit from my mom being white and the privilege that she has, I benefit from colorism. I’m fully aware I benefit from it and its something I haven’t always realized but now that I have realized it, I want to do things like this to delve deeper into where this stems from and why it exists and the ways that it shows up in people’s lives.

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OLA: Going off of that, I sent my mom all the semiformal pictures we had. In the Barbadian culture, you’d be considered white. I was like these are the black girls of KAPi, isn’t this so cute? And my mom was like, that one next to you isn’t black.

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MATISSE: Me?

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OLA: I was like yeah she is. We got into our normal argument like we always do. She was like what is she mixed with, and I was like she’s biracial, yes, but she’s black. Don’t do this. Here in the United States it’s a lot less black and white than in more predominately African American cultures, which is very interesting. It’s interesting to think about how in the diaspora it changes.

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MATISSE: That’s crazy. Thank you so much Ola!

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OLA: No problem, I love talking about this.

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It was great to have Ola join us today on “Watch Your Tone.” Her insight offered an interesting perspective and great things for us to consider when looking at colorism in our world. I expected this interview to only graze the surface of colorism, but I’m really happy with what Ola gave us in terms of content, allowing us to go beyond this. I was surprised to hear her personal stories- what resonated with me most was the story of her grandparents telling her to stay out of the sun and calling her “blackie”. This goes to show the cultural and even familial ties that colorism has. It isn’t something that is fleeting or generational- it’s a way of thinking. Our next episode will examine the effects and presence of colorism in hip-hop music, a genre that has been prevalent within the black community since its conception and has recently become America’s most popular music genre. It actually surpassed rock last year. From classic artists such as 2 Pac and Notorious B.I.G to up-and-coming rappers such as Playboi Carti, hip-hop and rap has often been a place for artists to express skin color preferences through their lyrics. A sample of this was even included at the start of this podcast, with a sample from Lil Wayne and Drake’s “Right Above It.” While darker skinned women were more commonly featured in hip-hop music videos in the 90’s and early 2000’s, this has declined sharply in more recent years. I’m looking forward to figuring out why this is on our next episode. Thank you for listening.

 

MUSIC: Complexion (A Zulu Love)- Kendrick Lamar